First Implant NExT Questions

Hello everyone.

I’m considering getting the NExT implant (https://dangerousthings.com/product/next/) but I still have a few questions about it.

  1. Are the NFC functionalities compatible with iPhones? Can I just put my implant next to an iPhone and it will detect what’s on there or how’s that working?

  2. We’re using this tag as part of our access control system at work: https://www.hidglobal.com/products/cards-and-credentials/indala/flexkey-keytag
    Is it possible to clone this on my RFID tag? What makes me unsure about it is this part in the description: “FlexSecur screens out unauthorized credentials prior to sending card data to the host system.”

Thank you for helping!

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  1. Depends on the phone. Anything past the iPhone 5, as long as it runs IOS 11 or later, it should be NFC compatible. (Refer to https://www.bluebite.com/nfc/iphone-nfc-compatibility). You might have trouble getting a read from the chip while it’s inside of the syringe due to the skin effect as was stated by Amal in a different thread.

  2. I can’t say for sure, as I’ve never seen or used that company’s readers or cards before. If you want to be careful, you could buy a cheap Chinese RFID cloner and a writable RFID card (such as the t5577). If it works with that card, it’s more than likely it would work with the implant as well.

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I have a iPhone 10 + a couple of different implants within me, the two that are contained within that one capsule I believe.

The iPhone 10 will read the xNT chip but with a bit of effort, as in I have to take off my leather case to start (it wont read it through that) and then it probably takes me 5 seconds of sweeping a very specific corner (top left - opposit side to the camera lens) over my hand in order to read the chip.

The NFC reader in the iPhone isn’t great, it is better on some Android phones. Also it is worth noting that Apple lock-down the NFC experience a lot more, think of it as a very read-only consumer experience on the iPhone. Whereas on a cheap old Android you can get a more comprehensive NFC experience with you also being able to write to chips. I’m a iPhone user mysefl but I recently picked up an old Android model for experimentation with my impants and that seems to be going well.

If you really want to stick to iPhone and you want shear ease then there is this app which allows you to talk to Siri and invoke the App and its scanning mode and you can customise what you say. So you’re phone could be idle / screen-off and you could say something like: “Siri scan me” and it would starting scanning / looking for your chip which you would have to present to it (at a distance which is essentially touching the back/corner of the phone.

The phone is not always looking for your tag, so it wouldn’t magically do something or detect your tag if you just presented it to the phone when it is just idle.

The same goes for Android as well I think. I think you may need to root/jail-break an android phone perhaps before it scans full-time, I’m not sure. I’m not an experience Android user so someone else might want to chime in there.

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If you have NFC turned on on an android phone, then when unlocked, it’s always looking for a tag. My Red Hydrogen 1 looks for a tag as long as the screen is on. But it won’t do anything with it if the screen is on but locked. My s10e doesn’t enable NFC until the screen is unlocked.

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Thanks for your response. That’s a very good idea!
Do you maybe have a recommendation in regards to the RFID cloner?

And as far as I’ve understood: Is it correct that our administration would have to add my unique ID into their system in order to allow me access? I believe I’ve read that every RFID card/implant/whatever has a unique ID.

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Thanks for your answer! I’ve just found out that it’s now possible to write to nfc tags with an iPhone (iOS 13):

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With regards to the RFID question, I’m assuming you are talking about the Low Frequency 125kHz xEM side of your NExT.
If so, you are pretty much correct.
What I would reccomend is:-

If your security card admin people are willing to enroll you NExT into your system, that will be the most simple and fastest way to go.
If you scan your NExT on the reader/writer they use to enroll your current access cards and it successfully reads it, they just need to enroll it. JOB DONE

Depending on the access readers being used, you may need to play around with finding the "sweet "spot for reading.
If you have a DT 125 kHz X Field Detector this will help a lot to find it…

If they won’t or cant enroll it, you will need to confirm if the NExT is compatible with your security system you provided in the link to above:-
https://www.hidglobal.com/products/cards-and-credentials/indala/flexkey-keytag 5

Hopefully some of the Gurus on here can answer that for you.

If it looks like it is compatible and if you end up needing to Clone your current security tag, I would reccomend…
first go with @ebryer suggestion in the message above. Cheap chinese cloner and get a/some T5577 card(s) to test on first.
EDIT
actually probably HID cards

DT are out of stock of the cheap cloners, however in this link there is a lot of info and a video, worth a read/watch

Failing that, if you want to invest in a Proxmark

alternatively
Depending on where you live, there might be somebody on here willing to help you out with access to their knowledge AND Proxmark.
Good luck I hope you manage to get it to work.

If so please share back here, as there may be others in the same situation at some stage.

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You are absolutely right! That is a new and exciting development from Apple/iOS that I only learnt of a short while after my post last night. Yep it seems the iOS 13 upgrade has unlocked a lot of NFC potential in iPhones now! Which I am stoked about.

We now have the ability to write NFC Tags from iPhones which we did not have before, I have played around with that extensively last night and it seems to work well.

Also they have a built in Shortcuts app now which allows you to automate things and actions in combination with NFC tags :slight_smile: this vid gives you a quick demo of that.

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So I’ve just ordered the Ultimate Kit.
I’m thinking about ordering this device in order to test the transfer of my work badge to a T5577 card first: https://www.amazon.de/dp/B07YZ4NQ35/ref=sr_1_16?__mk_de_DE=ÅMÅŽÕÑ&keywords=hid+rfid&qid=1570791425&sr=8-16
do you guys think this would be good? Unfortunately I live in Switzerland and during my research I’ve found nobody with a Proxmark device here.

One last thing that’s worrying me. I’ve got a pretty thin hand, comparable to a female hand. Is that a problem? Or would the implant just be a bit more visible?

There is a ton of discussion about this cloner. search the forums for “blue cloner”

TL;DR is if you aren’t super careful and know what you are doing, it’s easy to brick your xEM.

Read this

And know all blue cloners are not created equal. Quality varies quite a bit and most of them won’t clone HID cards.

You are better off with a Proxmark3 RDV4 and ProxLF antenna

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I’ve already read that. The Proxmark3 is quite expensive so I was just wondering if I could use a blue cloner and try my best first. If it’d brick the xEM I could still get a Proxmark3 afterwards and remove the password from the xEM, right?

Not necessarily, iirc when it gets bricked, there’s a chance it’s due to the data being corrupted while it’s being cloned, which makes it permanently bricked, not just locked. You can usually find a proxmark3 rdv4 on eBay for $35-70, so it’s not too expensive, though it can be a hassle to get up and running. Personally, I have used both the Proxmark and the blue cloner, and I’ve had luck with both. With the blue cloner, I had to take off the plastic front of it so I could pull out the copper coil and put it against my skin, which made it far easier to read/write than otherwise. However, the performance is obviously not as good as the Proxmark.

I can’t really find any used proxmark devices. In fact I can only find them new for a price of around 300 Euros.

@amal could you confirm if this would work or if it would infact brick it permanently:
“The Proxmark3 is quite expensive so I was just wondering if I could use a blue cloner and try my best first. If it’d brick the xEM I could still get a Proxmark3 afterwards and remove the password from the xEM, right?”

ebryer is right, if you have poor coupling with the blue cloners it can create tearing in the data which can permanently brick your implant.

They also often add a password when they do work, which sucks but can usually be overcome by looking it up or sniffing the output of the cloner with a proxmark.

The real Proxmark 3 is $250 and up. It looks like there’s a bunch of “Proxmark Easy” boards on eBay in the US for ~$80. Not sure what the difference is.

Without a doubt, the Promarx is cost prohibitive in comparison to the blue cloner. Is there really nothing in between?

Small correction… if you have a poor coupling with ANY device attempting to write… the blue cloners are getting the bad rep here because they have a shitty antenna and questionable data timing on their crap bitbanged 8bit uProc approach, but even a proxmark3 with a shit coupling could tear a T5577.

Cheap parts basically… this shows up the most with antennas unfortunately… large tolerance caps coupled to inductors of wide variances means you could end up with an antenna that is badly tuned, but still works fine with cards and keyfobs… just really not great with cylindrical antenna devices like x-series implants.

For the most part if you hold the antenna trace / coil of the pmeasy so it crosses the implant perpendicularly it should be ok though.

Hopefully my last question:
I’ve looked around for those Proxmark “clones” I’m currently deciding between buying one of those or a blue cloner. What do you guys think?

IMO, anything proxmark based is going to be superior as you have complete control over the commands and data being sent to your device. It gives you more options. While a true proxmark V3 is always the best option, Blue cloners are almost always the worst.

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