Hi guys, I’m new to anything to do with biohacking and want to start with a chip implant. I’m not quite sure what chip to purchase though. I originally wanted to get one to pay for things but quickly found out that is not possible. No worries since there is plenty more to do with the chips. What I would like to do with my chip is:
-People to be able to put their phone on my implant and get a link pop up (social media or about me page whatnot)
-Unlock my door, I’m not sure if it is possible, I really hope so. I am only half sure it would work with my door. My door model is a
Samsung SHP-DS510 (any help to if it would be possible would be awesome!)
-This option isn’t a must but is just a if it happens to be. Where I work we have key card access to unlock the doors. I’m not sure of the details but will try to find out soon.
There are obviously other uses but those first 2 are my top.
So I think this is where my problem may begin?
I’m new and am trying to put pieces together so correct me when I’m wrong. If I want people to be able to scan my chip to look at a profile page per say, I would need a…NFC chip right? Since iPhones and Samsung’s can only read that? (I’m aware that the older iPhones need an app to work with NFC chips but the newer ones work off the bat now I believe) so that would probably be a simple choice except, and this is where I’m hoping I’m wrong, to unlock my Samsung door, I would need to have a RFID chip? Once again I’m not 100% sure. So if this is the case where my top 2 wants are not mutual, does this mean I must just choose NFC (for profile and link stuff) or choose a RFID chip (unlocking home door lock and maybe work access cards?
I have, so many more questions, but this is my top priority. Any help goes more than appreciated. My apologies for writing long paragraphs but I’m useless at short writing. Thanks again and I’m eager to read any responses I get!
P.s. not sure if this is in the right topic but the website is only letting me choose between “project” and “support”
Looks like you have done your homework and you have most of the answers.
Your Samsung SHP-DS510 uses 13.56Mhz so there is a good chance this is going to be compatible with your phone and the NFC chips on the Dangerous Things website.
If I were in your situation, and the great thing is you know what you want to achieve; I would wait for one more bit of information before I made my decision. I would be finding out what technology my workplace uses for access. (in my ACTUAL case, my workplace scanners have 125 printed on them and when I bought my ULTRON upgrade kit it came with RFID diagnostic card that I used to confirm it was 125kHz I then used xLED field tester to find out the strongest antenna area and orientation)
I would suggest you:-1:
look for similar clues in the first instance
“google” / search the make model of the security system
ask your access control people (you may be able to convince them to enrol your implant later)
One of those options that should work for you however if you get stuck you
now have a chicken and egg situation
If you buy one of the kits it comes with the LED field tester and diagnostic tool or you can buy them separately to help you work out what tech you have.
if this is the situation MY recommendation would be to purchase the RFID diagnostic card
this will confirm it for you then when you buy your kit use your LED field tester to confirm best strength and orientation of the reader.
If it uses 125kHz, because of the chip DT have chosen for 125kHz it is very flexible and covers most tech in this freq range your options would most likely be the NExT
the bonus of this is it is on implant with both main freqs (125 & 13.56) so this would be perfect for this scenario.
or the xEM but this does only 125kHz so you would need another implant for your contact sharing and house access
If however, your workplace uses 13.56MHz
you will need to get as much info as you can and if you provide that here, I’m sure somebody will again be able to provide you some recommendations.
one thing to be aware of is the readability range of the chip is less than a flex so just bear that in mind when you come to choose your implant
Thank you so much for the reply, I’ve read it as thoroughly as i could. so from what I can gather, the NExT chip might be my best option. i hope you don’t mind if i ask a few more questions:
-The NExT is a RFID and a NFC chip in one capsule? (dumb question but I just cant help but make sure I understand it right)
-The Samsung SHP-DS510 (my door) works with NFC did you mention? If i wanted only to be able to unlock my door and share links/personal profile and forget the access card at work (hypothetically) would i only need a NFC chip implant? I ask since i just want to make sure i did not misunderstand when you said The
SHP-DS510 can unlock with NFC?
if that is the case i still would opt for the NExT since more, is better.
-How does the NExT work if it is a NFC and RFID in one, this may be a bad question but i haven’t looked to much into the tutorials of getting the chips programmed etc. If i had the chip, how does one write a profile for the NFC part of the chip, and then separately for the RFID side?
-related to the last question, Let’s say that my door lock was using NFC, and I also had a profile setup so that when someone puts their phone at my chip it gives them a link, how does the chip know the difference between my door, and someones phone? or can the NFC part of the chip only have one single use? I’m probably assuming wrongfully on how the chip operates in this situation.
All in all it sounds like the NExT is a great chip, is there any drawbacks that it has compared to other chips? if it can unlock my door and phones can read it and also possibly be used at my work then is this an all win?
i look forward to any and all responses as i love reading these forums and once again appreciate every reply and all information i receive.
You seem to have a pretty good handle on the situation. I don’t see anything in your last post that was inaccurate. Here’s some more info about the chips that might answer your questions:
A “dual-frequency” implant. It has two antennas in one implant. Each antenna circuit is tuned to one of the most commonly used RFID frequencies (125kHz and 13.56MHz.) Your phone can interact with the 13.56MHz (NFC) side without having any effect in the 125kHz side, because they’re tuned differently. To write to the 125kHz side you’d need some kind of writer/cloner, but you need to be careful when doing so.
You should be able to register your implant as a key for this door lock, because it operates at the same frequency (13.56MHz.) I don’t see it onthis list, but I think it will still work. The locks usually register a unique identifier(UID) inherent to each chip, so it shouldn’t be able to tell the difference between an implant and a regular NFC card. Sometimes they’re looking for a special “class” of card (like MIFARE) which could present a problem. Someone with more experience setting up Samsung locks might be able to say more.
The NExT is the best bang for your buck, and implanting it is very easy (it’s tiny and pre-loaded into a sterile syringe). The only potential issue is “coupling”. Locks and phones sometimes have a hard time reading the glass tag implants, because they use different shaped antennas (cylindrical vs flat.) If you use a NExT, you may have to contort your hand strangely to get a reliable read. Another option is the flexNT. It doesn’t have the added 125kHz functionality, but it is much easier to get a read because of the flat antenna. The only downside is that the install is more difficult. You can still use a piercing needle, but you need to make a pocket and insert the tag, rather than injecting it. Thankfully, both of these tags will allow you to write URL links using software like TagInfo.
thanks for reply! very informative, the first question that comes to mind is one of your last points being “coupling” how bad or good can this potentially be? can it be as bad as phones not ever picking up the chip? can it be sometimes perfect and work almost always? I wouldn’t mind having to make a fist for the chip to move in to position but I have a feeling if I’m trying to give someone my contact details and their phone cant pick it up unless I press their phone tightly against my skin while I squeeze my chip or something ridiculous kind of worries me since it would be a bit strange and a bit of a big let down. I don’t expect anything to work perfectly i just hope that it can be at least reliable.
Just to clarify … a tag and reader have a conversation… and like two humans talking, frequency compatibility is a must… if one person only produces vocal tones in the human range and the other is speaking ultrasonically, then only bats will be able to hear the latter person’s words… frequency compatibility ensures information can be transmitted and received properly by both parties, but like human language, frequency is just the carrier… it has nothing to do with the ability for two parties to actually be able to communicate. Of course it’s a requirement, but beyond that, frequency should be ignored as it has no bearing on effective communication between reader and tag.
Next is the “air interface”… the properties that define what “language” the tag and reader both speak. Some readers speak multiple languages, but tags typically only speak one language. The reader must understand the language of the tag in order to effectively communicate with it.
Finally, there are application specifics… and in 99% of cases, this is where shit falls apart… and Samsung door locks are no exception to this problem. For example, the Samsung Ezon locks use ISO14443A tags, specifically the locks ship with ISO14443A Mifare “Classic” 1k 4 byte NUID transponders. These are not NFC compliant, but they are ISO14443A. The ISO protocol is part of the Air Interface above… and there are tons of ISO14443A tags out there, including the NTAG216 which is ISO14443A and NFC Type 2 compliant. The way ISO14443A works follows a specific set of steps to set up communication with a tag in a reader field. Part of these steps includes a process called “selection”. When one or more tags enter the field of an ISO14443A compliant reader, the tags announce themselves by spitting out their ID numbers. The reader collects these IDs and then decides which tag it wants to talk to and issues a SELECT command, which basically says to all tags in the field “hey guys, I want to talk to tag AF 49 D3 F1 DE 54 41” and then every tag that isn’t AF 49 D3 F1 DE 54 41 will enter a HALT state and shut up, while AF 49 D3 F1 DE 54 41 enters the “selected” state and now the reader and tag can speak freely with each other over a clear channel.
So, anyone with any sense in their head would understand that any ISO14443A tag will always announce it’s ID number to the reader in exactly the same way, so an application like the Samsung Ezon door lock should be compatible with any ISO14443A tag, right? Wrong. Compatibility is all over the place. How could this be? Well, leave it to software developers to be just as “bad at computers” as users are. There are several ways to get the ID number of a tag, including actually reading the tag’s memory pages after it’s been selected to get the ID number directly from the tag’s memory instead of from the select process. Sometimes there are special commands you can issue to the tag to ask it for it’s ID number. This also occurs after the select process. So again, anyone with any sense would simply wonder why not just use the ID communicated during the select process and be done with it? Yeah… good question.
There are other potential issues that could gum up the works if a firmware developer doesn’t think things through, like the fact a Mifare “Classic” chip has a 4 byte NUID (non-unique ID) and most other ISO14443A tags have a 7 byte UID (unique ID - because more bytes, get it)… so maybe they didn’t consider a user wanted to use tags other than what shipped with the actual lock and don’t properly accommodate a 7 byte ID. Also with certain chips like the DESFire, it is possible to enable “privacy mode” which creates a random ID number for every session, and the only way to get the real ID is to first authenticate and then query for the real ID… but honestly, Samsung does not do this, and DESFire chips are not in private mode by default, and I have yet to have a DESFire chip work with any Samsung lock I’ve tested.
In short, I don’t know what was floating around in the minds of the Samsung engineers when they design these things… all I know is that Samsung Ezon locks are all over the place when it comes to compatibility with any chips other than the Mifare Classic 1k 4 byte NUID chips they ship with. Testing each lock model with each chip you want to try is the only way to know for sure.
All of the above… it can be perfect or impossible… just comes down to trying. I know that sucks as an explanation, but our product is only one part in a two-part conversation, and we have no control over that other part… so anything is possible. Typically though, you can find the correct location and orientation to achieve a proper scan. It usually comes down to orientation. Check this vid for more info about coupling;
Thank you for the in depth explanation, I understood most of it haha, from what you said it sounds like Samsung isn’t to smart, no surprises there for me. I guess I’ll just have to hope for the best with my implant and test it with my Samsung door lock, When I get a chip (probably the NExT?) I’ll update somewhere in the forums so hopefully anyone else with the same question can know. BTW the video helped me understand the coupling situation better and how orientation is important, any repeating trend on how to orientate the chips for iPhones/Samsungs? Better luck with the chips working horizontal to the phones? I also might be wrong but the NFC is best detected in the middle of the iPhones and Samsungs? I know I will hopefully confirm and find out a lot of this information when my chip comes along but that will be a little while since I’m Australian.
My biggest worry is still the coupling With phones, from what Ive read up, the new Iphones (XR XS) can now read NFC without an app running. But I think they can only do internet links (which Im happy enough with if so) So if this is the case I guess if I find a good orientation to put my hand to Iphones/Samsungs when over my hand then I should be set.
Edit, I was reading over the forum, and saw someone’s chip had “rotated” 90°, which he was told was no big deal, but someone also commented that it made their phone scan the chip easier when it happend to them, not saying I would put the chip in sideways but theoretically, if you did, is it possible or more likely for phones to pick up? Because if people are putting their phones on your chip straight on, doesn’t that mean the orientation is not as good as when they put their phone straight on to your hand while the chip is 90° to the side?
There are simply too many devices to make videos of every one of them… that’s why we created the xLED so you can test devices yourself to find the best location and orientation, and xLEDs ship free with every implant now!
This is because they didn’t realize that the phone’s rotation mattered… it’s far easier and safer to simply present your phone at a 90 degree angle than it is to attempt to positing the installation of an implant 90 degrees from being parallel with the bone.