that wording is exactly what makes it easy to refute for single individual installs.
Break the chain and there is no longer a “program” there.
Agree with you there.
But again, funding a church will not change that.
Piercers who are that self preserving will not join a church just to do some implants.
And the ones who really want that niche market are the ones who won’t stop doing them anyway, because the law is not forbidding it at all.
The piercers themselves wouldn’t have to join specifically to perform the procedures. The church would formalize a precedent to allow implants (classified as a “religious ceremony”) to be installed, which would give body mod artists legal protection from any blowback from the law.
That would:
A) not be needed. Since there is no wording there forbiding an individual to be implanted, nor forbiding another individual being paid to perform such procedure.
B) not protect any body piercer.
If funding a church could protect the piercers in any way, then doctours should be able to perform abortions anywhere in the states.
But they can’t.
The Satanic Church is allowed to perform abortions as part of its ritae, but that does not grant any legal protection to doctors doing it.
Maybe that’s the answer, get the satanic tempel to sign off implants
afaik they already do that.
Yeah. Bodily autonomy is tenet #3 (“One’s body is inviolable, subject to one’s own will alone.”). Abortions + body modifications are both covered under that tenet.
So if I get this right, there already is a church that covers all that what the “church of transhumanism” was meant for?
Yes but it’s steeped in Christian mumbo jumbo, hence not desirable.
Why not, if it works it should be fine 
agreed
You of all people should know that the nature of the source of good things matters as much as the good things. Your country’s leaders in the 30s and 40s were dead against tobacco for all the right reasons for instance, yet I’d rather be smoking if that’s the kind of people who spread the good word.
Seems like it to me 
The Satanic Temple was brought up earlier in this thread, and personally I still think that it’s the best solution if more laws crop up.
While I understand the hesitation due to the Christian connotations with the name, they’re a really good organization. I’m a member, and they do a ton of activism overall, especially for abortions and LGBTQIA+ folk.
I have a feeling they would be more than happy to help with any issues from our community.
They’re also relatively effective in a way that I’m not sure we could manage on any kind of short time scale (both due to membership numbers + experience). I live in Indiana, and within hours of the legislature proposing a fetus burial law (forcing woman to pay for a full funeral and burial for an aborted fetus), TST had already emailed out religious wavers for everyone in our state.
Hmmm, that’s a difficult one. It really depends on how intertwined with - in this case - politics the topic is. If you’d say “I stop smoking because Hitler told me to”, you would be a total idiot If you say “I stop smoking because it’s unhealty”, and Hitler realized early that smoking is unhealty, too, I’d say everything is fine. Beside that, I didn’t even know that he was against tobacco 
I have no problems at all with The Satanic Temple (aside from the fact that it’s not looking very “satanic” to me, but we had that earlier ), and if they fight for the right things, I am willing to support them. Might just be a nice counterweight for overly-christian countries - I recently looked, and they didn’t have a german offspring, for example… guess they would just not be seen as very revolutionary here^^
And they do so in a country where this is desperately needed. Big thumbs up from my side.
Since you already said that you’re a member, did you talk to them about the problems you face with implants in the US? Or maybe you could make some contact between them and Amal, or whatever, to actually get things going
Unfortunately not due to COVID, plus to be honest, it wasn’t a priority for myself personally, since Indiana has thankfully not attempted to pass any implant laws yet (think we’re one of the least regulated states for implants).
I can definitely shoot them a message though, explaining our community a bit, and our concerns with the proposed legislation, and how it would interfere with tenet 3.
I know from experience that there are a LOT of body mod folks in TST, so I don’t imagine it would really be anything new to them.
I do: it’s a religion. It don’t matter what denomination, they’re a bunch of people dedicated to magical thinking and irrationality. As such, they can eat broken glass. I’m not going to join a religion just because they happen agree with me on certain things. Fundamentally, I’m profoundly incompatible with that organization and all the others like it.
I want to join a fake religious organization, whose stated purpose is bringing down religion or turning religious rules on their heads. That’s why I’m a Pastafarian, and I’ll happily join the Church of Transhumanism if it’s ever a thing. But Satanists? No way jose. Nor Christians, Muslims, buddhists, Shintoists, Animists, Hinduists or any other nonsense, even if they paid me a million bucks. They can all fuck right off.
If you like, take a look at their homepage - I did, and they are pretty much exactly what you say there
That’s why I say it’s a bit strange for me that they call themselves Satanists, but that’s just for the “turning heads” thing^^
Are you maybe confusing the Church of Satan with The Satanic Temple?
The Satanic Temple is strictly non-theistic, and to be honest, is a religion in the same way atheism is a religion IMO.
It’s closer to a club.
Direct quote from their website:
“Do you worship Satan?”
“No, nor do we believe in the existence of Satan or the supernatural. The Satanic Temple believes that religion can, and should, be divorced from superstition. As such, we do not promote a belief in a personal Satan. To embrace the name Satan is to embrace rational inquiry removed from supernaturalism and archaic tradition-based superstitions. Satanists should actively work to hone critical thinking and exercise reasonable agnosticism in all things. Our beliefs must be malleable to the best current scientific understandings of the material world — never the reverse.”
Tenet 5 also states: “Beliefs should conform to one’s best scientific understanding of the world. One should take care never to distort scientific facts to fit one’s beliefs.”.
TST was founded to use the mechanisms and special protections provided to religions in the US to fight against religions attempting to abuse a lack of separation between church and state.
Basically fighting fire with fire.
To my knowledge, nowhere do they say “we pray Satan for the lulz and to piss people off beause Satan doesn’t really exist” do they? Or the sarcasm was missed on me.
I’ll go have a look to make sure 
Hmm maybe I might. I thought there was only one.
Okay time to do some fact-checking. Be right back.
To be honest, I read that kind of sarcasm in the writings of LaVey (Church of Satan) as well, and I still think he was a funny guy who said a lot of interesting things in the 60s and 70s - and his “magic” was more of a carnival-funfair-thing, at least to me.
But with TST, it’s really obvious. They are not religious at all, but they use the provocation of their name to move some things. Like I said, from a european point of view, they are just stating obvious stuff few people would disagree to, but in the US, it’s a bit different…