Considering getting implants. Have a few questions and need to get my research confirmed

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I did some RFID research for a project a year or two ago, but the information and then different protocols is quite overwhelming. Even though I have done some research I still don’t know enough and I feel more confused than anything else. I have done a good bit of searching and reading on the forum including reading through this: https://forum.dangerousthings.com/t/wiki-beginners-guide-to-implants-becoming-a-cyborg/5170

I’ve been thinking that if I were to pull the trigger on this it would have to be the NExT https://dangerousthings.com/product/next/ implant in my left hand and the xM1 “magic” 1k https://dangerousthings.com/product/xm1/ in my right hand. Both implants would have to be in the recommended spot between my thumb and index finger. The reason for xM1 would be that it looks like that’s what the door system in my apartment building uses.

I’ve tried scanning g the fob with the NXP taginfo app and provided screenshot 1 and 2 https://imgur.com/a/r2aTUIy to make sure that I am correct when I say I should be able to copy my fob to a xM1 implant.

I have a transit card, but that’s a Mifare Plus X (See screenshot 3 and 4 https://imgur.com/a/r2aTUIy ). NXP taginfo reports that the transit card as “MIFARE classic compatible”, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that the scanners would accept it and even if I would have to choose between the transit card or the door to my home.

I don’t really have any practical use for the NExT other than it would be cool. I’m out of a job right now, but could be used for a work badge. I obviously don’t know what technology that work badge would use.

I don’t really have any interest in building stuff, I don’t own a car or have my own garage. All I have is the door system to the apartment. Maybe I’d begin with using the NExT to store my vCard and unlocking my computer, but other than that I don’t really have any use cases for it at the moment.

Now for some questions

Let’s say I hypothetically wanted to buy some kind of lock. I did a quick Google search, but didn’t actually know what I was looking for on the spec sheet to figure out if it would work with the NExT. What is the best way of figuring something like this out?

There’s no way the apartment owners are going to let me enroll a chip in my hand to their system, but copying it myself would lock the xM1 to that specific function or no?

I’m aware of the flex products that has a better read range, but is the x series chips read range bad? Like do you have to REALLY press your hand hard against the scanner to get good read? Not that it matters, I’m just curious.

The NFC side of the NExT is writeable with a phone, but I would need a writer for the LF part of the chip and I don’t even know with the xM1. With the NXP tagwriter app for android I am able to copy my fob to a xM1 right?

Would it be better for me to get some RFID / NFC cards and readers/writers to familiarize myself a little before getting it implemented into my body?

I know it’s a lot, but I’ve just felt so overwhelmed by trying to figure out what’s what and what works with what.

I don’t know if I am going to go through with it. I live in Denmark , so getting it here might be a hassle and top of that the only professional installer on the map here is in the other end of the country. I really think the idea is cool even if I’m not going to use it much. I’m also a techhead and like stuff like this so that would almost be reason enough, but I do want to get something that can be useful and the combo of NExT and xM1 seems to be a compatible solution with a lot of stuff and also be quite a future proof solution.

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No, only flexM1 gen2 can be written with the phone. Phones can’t send the backdoor command.

Wouldn’t hurt, atleast try to clone stuff onto a card before you clone it on an in vivo chip.

Yeah often. Some products just work with flexes.

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Definately looks compatible, can you just confirm the NUID is 4Byte ( 00:00:00:00 ) and not 7Byte ( 00:00:00:00:00:00:00 )
If 4Byte, you should be good to go

I am not familiar with Mifare Plus X, but because it is

“MIFARE classic compatible”
but we will need more info to confirm, or somebody who knows…

Currently my personal favourite implant

Sort of, but only while you need it to be, but if you owned something you could still enroll it into other locks etc.

It has less to do with proximity, but MORE to do with coupling ie. Coupling through optimal orientation

only NDEF, you can’t change the UID of the HF side

yes or enrolled into system
you have a couple of reader/writer options

Proxmark3 Easy / RDV4 or enroll it

only flexM1 gen2 with your phone, otherwise you will need a Proxmark3 ( either Easy or RDV4 )

Always a good option
https://labs.ksec.co.uk/product/complete-test-card-bundle/

Not really, It shows you did your research, so thanks for that

not really, DT or you can use KSEC in Europe
https://labs.ksec.co.uk/product/custom-cyborg-builder/

You can approach any with the correct information

Mate, you have just nailed it, I agree whole heartedly.

As I was typing @yeka beat me to it, but I agree also

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Why do I even try to answer @Pilgrimsmaster…?
I should stop once I see you typing…

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Ha, not at all, like I say I agree with your comments… mine just doubled up what you said.
I should just delete mine

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No, you answered like 3 times more questions!
It’s so moch more detailed, as it always is.

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Still not familiar, but a quick bit of research

7-Byte Unique Identifier (UID) or 4-Byte Non Unique
Identifier (NUID) and random IDs

KEY BENEFITS
Fully backwards compatible with MIFARE Classic
with 1K or 4K memory

That sounds promising, however, your card is 4k, I think the best way to confirm if it would work would be to get a Mifare 1k test card to practice/test on.

Also your other reader / writer option could be

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You and @yeka are awsome. I did not expect to get an answer this quick.

I can’t find NUID or UID anywhere, but under “Full scan” there is a section called Detailed protocol information where it says “ID: XX:XX:XX:XX” So it looks like I’m good to go with that.

I would need to copy it. There is no way they’d enroll it into their system. In case I move out and they forget about the chip in my hand I would now have access to a building and apartment I no longer should have access to.

I was kind of hoping to maybe avoid the Proxmark 3 all together mainly because I feel like it’s a lot of money. Buit if it’s the best option I’ll rather throw some money after a Proxmark 3 RDV4.01 rather than half assing it. The standard kit should cover me right? https://lab401.com/products/proxmark-3-rdv4?variant=12406152560751 Did see a post somewhere here mentioning the RDV4 having issues with the implants inside the glass capsule, but I don’t know if there is any truth to it and I can’t find the post now.

I think I know what I have to do now. Get some test card for practice https://labs.ksec.co.uk/product/complete-test-card-bundle/
And a Reader / Writer. Would it be better to go for the Proxmark https://lab401.com/products/proxmark-3-rdv4?variant=12406152560751 or would a combination of the two reader / writers you posted be able to cover me? This https://dangerousthings.com/product/acr122u/
and this https://dangerousthings.com/product/blue-cloner/
You guys have been very helpful. Thank you so much.

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Yes indeedy

Not NEED to, but you could copy it, or if hand back ( no pun intended ) your card and then scan you xM1 into their system instead of a card, when / if you left, they would deauthorise this from their system.

Depending on the exchange rate, you could look at
https://labs.ksec.co.uk/product/proxmark-3-rdv4-kit/

Up to you on how much cash you want to drop, but

So, depending on how much you would use it , the RDV4 would be a great option for a professional, but a Proxmark3 Easy is still a very good option for any enthusiast or even pro

This would be a VERY good option, BUT just the RDV4 or Easy would do both jobs, and slightly “better”

No problem

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About the NEED to copy thing…

That’s the usual case with RFID systems.
The ID is the key, once you have the ID you can’t give it back.
That they take your card when you leave just shows that they don’t understand it.
Maybe explain everything calmly and show them the keys vs rfid video?

Also, you could just promise them to overwrite it yourself once you’re gone.

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Asking them to enroll the chip into their system is not going to hurt anybody and would definetly be where I would start.

Wouldn’t surprise me tbh. It could also just be a case of them being responsible if they enroll it, but if I copy it myself they are not to blame. I would of course not abuse it to get access after the fact and just overwrite it with something.

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I’m going to see if I can’t get my hands on a Proxmark 3 easy then. Thank you.

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