The anti🚫-derailment🚃 & thread🧵 hijacking🔫 thread🧵 ⁉

[anon3825968]

@anon7067117

I think this is a very simplistic view. The way I understand it, it is supposed ro represent an unfathomable, willing sacrifoce on behalf of people who did not deserve it.

It’s not simplistic, it’s simple. As in pure logic simple. One major trait of religious people is their willingness to hold several incompatible views in their mind and work really hard towards believing they belong together.

If you look at the naked truth like I do, you see people who wear miniature instruments of torture on their person, patronize a place of worship with depictions of a man being tortured, and genuinely believe it’s a good symbol. What part of “torture” do those people not understand? There’s nothing good in crucifixion. They can spin it any which way they want, and try to turn the plain awfulness of it into any positive thing they want, it just doesn’t stack up.

Really. Does it for you? Especially as a non-Christian? Surely you must find it appalling too. Just imagine if I painted a gas chamber on my front porch and I told you the suffering of the jews in WWII death camps is a symbol of peace on Earth and love for mankind in my system of belief: would you not think I’m totally bonkers?

[Coma]

@anon3825968

you see people who wear miniature instruments of torture on their person, patronize a place of worship with depictions of a man being tortured, and genuinely believe it’s a good symbol

I was, like Axolotl, often told that it was a symbol for the “sacrifice” god made for mankind (to cleanse them from sin… sigh. bad concept, I think ). But the point of the story was that the guy who was tortured to death didn’t stay dead - instead, he resurrected and gave back hope. So why not chose a picture of “resurrecting Jesus”? Dunno what symbol would be fitting, but I think some clever minds would find one. Something positive, hopeful, happy. That kinda tells “the whole story” and not just the literally worst part of it…

@anon3825968

Just imagine if I painted a gas chamber on my front porch and I told you the suffering of the jews in WWII death camps is a symbol of peace on Earth and love for mankind in my system of belief

Baaaaad idea
There is an industrial project in Germany that uses samples of Hitler’s speeches and other WWII-stuff, to show the horrors and bottomless terror / insanity of war (especially of that war, but as well of any other). Needless to say, they are very often misunderstood. (And I know one of them, they are quite far on the left side of the spectrum )

@anon3825968

If I was to choose to believe in mumbo-jumbo, I would probably choose buddhism

From an aesthetical point of view, I like nordic mythology and ancient egyptian ones… those gods were so wonderfully human, and they still had incredible stories!

[anon3825968]

@Coma

But the point of the story was that the guy who was tortured to death didn’t stay dead - instead, he resurrected and gave back hope. So why not chose a picture of “resurrecting Jesus”?

Hmm… Because it’s stupid? Nobody rises from the dead. It doesn’t happen.

Like I said, religion goes against the grain of reality. What you’re proposing is choose to revel in the symbol of a man being tortured to death (for real, if Jesus ever lived) or revel in a totally nonsensical resurrection story.

And it’s far from the only “inspirational” life story in the Bible. We’re supposed to love God and believe God loves us - the same God that sent His people intto bondage in Egypt, killed hundreds of thousands of them in the deserts of Israel for no good reason, who let his own son die horribly on the cross (to be reborn no doubt, but he still suffered). What gives? How can anyone with a two digit IQ believe there’s anything positive to derive from all this mass murder and suffering?

What I propose is to cast aside the mumbo-jumbo, look at the wonders of real life and nature, delight in the scientific understanding of what we’ve managed to discover so far, and the challenge of what we haven’t yet. Isn’t this a better and more productive use of one’s brainpower? Surely…

@Coma

nordic mythology

They’re good stories. I like the Sagas particularly. But they’re only stories, to be looked at and enjoyed for what they are and nothing more. Anybody who believes in Nordic gods is as crazy as any cross-bearing Christian.

[Coma]

@anon3825968

Hmm… Because it’s stupid? Nobody rises from the dead. It doesn’t happen.

Sure, but the guy nailed on a piece of wood is equally stupid - it happened, okay, but the symbol is there because it was not just “one man nailed on a cross”, but because it was “god’s son nailed on a cross”. Otherwise, it wouldn’t be a symbol at all… So you can take the same nonsensical story and just take a better part of it for a symbol

@anon3825968

But they’re only stories, to be looked at and enjoyed for what they are

I think many old stories and mythologies of all kind can be read as “what they are”, or you can think about them and maybe gain some new insights. Not in the way that I believe the Norns are ruling my fate or such, but… hmm. I like, for example, the way the worlds are built - it’s all connected, and everything depends on another. That’s just a concept that I like, even though I am totally aware that I am not sitting on some giant tree with a dragon-like creature gnawing at its roots

[anon3825968]

@Coma

So you can take the same nonsensical story and just take a better part of it for a symbol

Yeah… Or you can chose to do something better with your life. The whole thing doesn’t deserve more than 30 seconds of the thinking man’s attention at the end of the day, is my point.

@Coma

I am totally aware that I am not sitting on some giant tree with a dragon-like creature gnawing at its roots

You say that, but how do you know? It’s no more nonsense than the Christian view of the world. Russell’s teapot tells us it probably is nonsense, but stricto sensu, it might just be true.

Playing devil’s advocate and staying true to my dedication to strict logic here

[Coma]

@anon3825968

The whole thing doesn’t deserve more than 30 seconds of the thinking man’s attention at the end of the day, is my point.

Brain exercise and curiosity

@anon3825968

You say that, but how do you know?

I can’t. I can’t prove or disprove it myself at all. But I can choose to trust science and agree to the point that the earth is a more-or-less even globe, hanging out in space, orbiting another big globe. Doesn’t sound that much more logical, but it is

@anon3825968

It’s no more nonsense than the Christian view of the world.

No, of course not - and like I said, in a lyrical way of thinking, I like it. I like to think of the two big ravens on my back as Hugin and Munin, flying across the world and telling me what they saw at the end of the day, just because I love that story.

[anon3825968]

@Coma

But I can chose to trust science and agree to the point that the earth is a more-or-less even globe, hanging out in space, orbiting another big globe

Amen sister

@Coma

Doesn’t sound that much more logical, but it is

It is because there’s evidence to back it up - as opposed to religion where, if you’re very lucky there’s zero evidence, and usually there’s more than enough evidence against it.

[LordSethos2000]

why don’t they call it “Christian Mythology” in alignment with all the others?

[Backpackingvet]

So to preface, I grew up catholic, had to get confirmed, all that jazz. I was never a devout believer. Starting in catechism classes, I would always question this stuff. The stories, the wonder, the magic that the Bible held never made sense to me.

I would routinely get pulled aside and told to quit being disruptive in class,and to feel it inside that this all happened.

Well, needless to say they were just happy when I showed up and kept my mouth shut.

When it was close to confirmation, I just didn’t care anymore. I would come to class, and ask thought provoking questions to my teachers, i.e. "If he loves us so, why does he allow kids to starve to death? "

Pretty sickening listening to adults justify why they deserve it.

[Insert 4 paragraphs of rambling I deleted]

Long story short, was born and raised catholic, but I’m a sinner in their eyes.

@anon3825968

If I was to choose to believe in mumbo-jumbo, I would probably choose buddhism

If I have to follow a modern religion it would be Sikhism. Mainly because they are the among the best people I have met.

Older? Just any earth religions.

@Coma

I like, for example, the way the worlds are built - it’s all connected, and everything depends on another.

Yeah so I understand this.

I myself have dabbled in Psilocybin mushrooms. After several great experiences, and one (at the time) bad trip, I feel I am a better person for it. I see the world and universe as all being connected, making a shared memory. I don’t think life ever has been or will be the same for me. After all that I have come to a cliché conclusion, but words cannot put the emotions behind them.

Love is really the only thing that matters in this world.

(Not condoning drugs. Was trying out some alternative therapy under guidance)

[yeka]

@anon3825968

It is because there’s evidence to back it up

Sometimes I freak out about the fact that the universe just exists. “Why is there something, rather than nothing?”

I can accept that I’m just a weird chemical reaction on a blue marble in a complex construct of other marbles… but I won’t ever get the existence part.

[anon3825968]

Yes! those are the interesting questions - and the vertigo you experience when you think about em is the real thrill. When you answer those questions with religion, you slam the door shut on those interesting subjects.

[yeka]

Right? Also, religion doesn’t even answer that. It just moves it one layer further. Why does god exist?It even opens up more questions about a whole new universe in which god exists.

I can see how religion may calm you down, but I’d rather freak out about my existence and the fine tuning of the universe and what not then believe that a flying spaghetti monster created this world.

[anon3825968]

Well, generally, religion offers explanations to unanswerable question that are impossible to disprove, and religious leaders insist that since you can’t disprove them, they must be true - which is a logical fallacy.

The other thing that happens is, when science and technology finally answers long unanswered questions and religions is proven patently wrong, instead of recanting, religious people will twist their stories and pretend they’re parables of some higher truths that are somehow compatible with the new proven knowledge that science has offered, and go all metaphysical on you.

So much energy spent on bullshit, it boggles the mind.

[Coma]

@Backpackingvet

Love is really the only thing that matters in this world.

Not meaning to totally sound like a hippie - but this. is. so. true. That’s kinda what I meant when I said in some other discussion here, that we are finally all made of stardust, just like everything else. We are basically all made from the same few substances, and I have zero right to feel superior to a bird, a tree or a stone. That is a thought that just calms me down, maybe in a way religion does for other people.

@yeka

Sometimes I freak out about the fact that the universe just exists

Yep. And because I know too little of physics, I can explain just a little bit of the world around myself - so I can experience the wonders of the world, be totally amazed by nature, and how everything just works perfectly fine (except for the stupid shit humanity tends to do…). And I experience beauty, and want to find out more about it, to understand it, and be even more impressed afterwards.

@anon3825968

those are the interesting questions - and the vertigo you experience when you think about em is the real thrill.

Totally agree on that, and on the way religion shuts down such questions. Like, to get back to nordic mythology (because it’s a bit more nature-related) - people in the older days didn’t know what lightning and thunder was, so they had that idea of Thor in his chariot, throwing his hammer and thus creating the sound and lightning. By now, we know what really causes them - and that’s even more impressive! So, science doesn’t disenchant the world at all And if I feel poetic, I might still think of Thor if I’m standing in a thunderstorm, just because it’s a nice picture.

[amal]

[anon7067117]

I could talk like Jar Jar and have someone snap and murder me, how bout that?

[Backpackingvet]

Never seen the movies, but wasn’t there a meme about him being some Badass fighter?

[amal]

@Backpackingvet

some Badass fighter?

nobody said you’d get to fight like him hahah

[anon2520759]

Look like, 100%

[Midoriya]

@LordSethos2000

why don’t they call it “Christian Mythology” in alignment with all the others?

I do, people often need a second to realise what I am referring to :v