VivoKey Apex update

[MTFT]

taginfo showed 1024 max size and nfc tools seemed to work, thanks!

Not sure why it crashes tagwriter…

Side question, maybe better for the man himself but how cautious should we be with the new process packaging? should I not really be handling it until install after confirming it works or is it fine to handle with care or what?

[Pilgrimsmaster]

@MTFT

how cautious should we be with the new process packaging? should I not really be handling it

Not the best quote, but I think it answers your question

@amal

Just to be very clear about sterile packaging. The pouches things come in are DESIGNED to be full of holes. The paper backing MUST be full of holes to allow the sterilant INTO the INSIDE of the sterilization pouch. But once sterilized and removed from the processor (autoclave or EO chamber or whatever), those holes immediately work against you and can easily allow bacteria and viruses right on into the pouch if not handled extremely carefully . This is why we do not just shuffle around our inventory after receiving it from the EO processor… it is bagged and sealed and we leave our products in those bags until kitting, which is when we put them (while wearing gloves) into the kit poly bag and seal that up… and then put a sticker on that to tell customers not to open it until install day… all that is to minimize contamination through that shitty fishnet of a paper backing.

Things that can ruin sterilization;

• touching with bare skin (skin oils easily penetrate the paper, dragging in germs with it)
• getting it even remotely damp (water vapor further destroys the paper and drags germs in)
• thermal cycling (even small changes in air temperature of only 10 degrees is enough to force air in and out of the pouch through the paper, like it’s breathing… and it’s breathing in germs)
• looking at it wrong (your dirty eyes are only exceeded by your dirty thoughts)

[amal]

Yeah best not to handle it too much. The inside of the polymer sleeve is not sterile and it will contaminate the pouch contents of handled too much… it’s just things like water or body oils will contaminate the pouch much much faster so we put it in the sleeve to protect against that.

[MTFT]

Thanks for the clarification!

I presume that handling it to scan a few times and confirm functionality is hopefully not too bad since i already did that, but I will now put it back in the box and very excitedly await installation

[amal]

Some gentle handling is fine… but smashing it to a phone and putting pressure directly on the product to hold it up to things is not a good idea.

[h3105]

Maybe another silly question, but have the emails for the flex one backers gone out?
Haven‘t received one yet.

[yeka]

It was mentioned elsewhere, you gotta DM amal with your order ID if you didn’t get the mail.

[amal]

@h3105

but have the emails for the flex one backers gone out?

yes they did… twice now DM me with deets

[Eriequiet]

Someone’s going to pop in and ask about flex one betas when apex2 drops

[h3105]

Well I‘m just busy with lots of projects and remembered that I should receive an Email.

[Eriequiet]

It’s not a you thing, it’s a running joke at this point

[camal3ao]

Hey Amal,

I went to the installer listed under Salt Lake City and I have a feeling that this might be the same guy that @Ben_bionic went to since I saw somewhere else that he had his done in the same state.

How he flattens the needle I am not sure because I didn’t realize that is what he was doing and I was took excited to point this out. He doesn’t flatten it into a “blade” but more of an oval shape so that it goes in easier. I have done 2 self-installs despite the fact that I hate needles and didn’t want to watch this one go in. It honestly felt about the same as the 3mm needle. It went in so easy I was shocked.

He took video of the needle and I think of my install as well (with my permission). I think he will send 1 if not both to you. You have my permission to ask him for the install video if he doesn’t automatically send it.

As a side note, he said he shoved one of these in someone’s finger to install a magnet. That guy deserves a medal.

[Ben_bionic]

Agree that the flat needle was a very smooth process it didn’t feel like it had any real resistance. I wish I had taken video, but I only have the pictures posted.

[camal3ao]

I usually do not film these sort of things and they only reason I told them they could record the install was because he said he took a video of the needle flattening to send in to Amal.

He was also confused as to why the Vivokey has a separate website from Dangerous Things despite the fact that he has been installing these things for years it seems which I found amusing. Even offered to order in the kit for me which was interesting.

[Eriequiet]

@camal3ao

I usually do not film these sort of things and they only reason I told them they could record the install was because he said he took a video of the needle flattening to send in to Amal.

You do want to make sure you record flex installs going forward, it is part of the warranty for flexes with the rise in people using metal tools and possibly causing some failures

Update on Dangerous Things warranty coverage

Hello everyone. Lately we have been challenged a few different ways with our warranty policy. We’ve had to make some critical changes to the way we handle warranty claims. The biggest change is the warranty policy as it applies to flex vs x-series. Flex products are simply too easy for customers and untrained installers to mishandle, that we are limiting the warranty significantly. Of course, we can decide to side with and support the customer on a case by case basis, and most likely will do so,…

[camal3ao]

Understood. Missed that post. Good thing it works or that would have been a problem although they did film it themselves.

I wonder if the tool being metal has something to do with sterilization.
If that is true I wonder if there is another tool that would be sufficient for them to use without risk of damaging the product. Just because unless the skin is lifted I feel like there will be issues with that last part of the install since most likely you are now dealing with blood and maybe they can’t find enough purchase on the implant to finish pushing it in by hand.

[camal3ao]

Nevermind, found the answer to that comment

Update on Dangerous Things warranty coverage

Your blanket policy was always very generous, and I would hate to think the change has come about from a person(s) taking advantage of that. I think your new policy is still more than fair, and I hope it gives you the same protection it now does for us. The only issue I see is, the possibility of the installers not wanting ANYTHING documented, However, if people simply emphasise The installer’s name, face, location, procedure prep, etc. is not necessary That should be a easy sell to a reas…

[amal]

@camal3ao

took video of the needle and I think of my install as well (with my permission). I think he will send 1 if not both to you. You have my permission to ask him for the install video if he doesn’t automatically send it.

I’m definitely interested… nothing yet. Please ask for them!

[camal3ao]

I will reach out to the installer and ask him send it to you.