The antišŸš«-derailmentšŸšƒ & threadšŸ§µ hijackingšŸ”« threadšŸ§µ ā‰

All you need is
:pig2:

piglet

Thatā€™s exactly why I said:

Wouldnā€™t that kind of defeat the purpose? Granted, it would be an embeded mass storage device, but youā€™d have to lug around a custom cable for it, at which point you might as well carry a flash drive. And the above mentioned issues with transdermals would still persist. It sure would be really cool though :slight_smile:

Same thing with a USB-C cable, thoughā€¦

If weā€™re talking about a hypothetic device, I would also embed a wireless transfer protocol. Slower than a direct connection, but useful as a backup, and would allow you to not worry about the cable that much.

Also, on that thought, we could design a flexible adapter: usb-c to custom, which can be worn better than a storage solution could.

There are options, and the Tech exists.
The main problem is the amount of resources and human hours required to make a prototype which, besides our vanity, does not really solve any problems, therefore harder to make that much money backā€¦

You are right at that, but the chance of finding a USB C cable in any one place is exponentially higher then finding a custom unicorn cable - this of course isnā€™t a problem if itā€™s just for personal use, then you can have the cable anywhere where you spend a lot of time. But I still donā€™t see the practicality of that. :confused:

There already is a slow wireless transfer protocol that requires you to have a reader for itā€¦ itā€™s bitrate is abysmall, thoughā€¦ NFC :slight_smile:

The tech does exist, and I think that a prototype is probably feasable, but there is still a myriad of smaller problems. As stated above, transdermals, kinda not ideal. Also, how would we prevent ergress into th3 connector? Then there are all the other things from everyday life. If itā€™s just a PoC, it could probably be done

@Eyeux
Would you like some of these theoretical implants posts moved to your dream chip thread?

If it is your dream to implant significant storage memory devices!?

I donā€™t mind either way, but happy to do it if you want

perhaps a magnetic USB-C adaptor with surface connectors, similar to this

could be a good Idea.

Although I feel like this should be a question to a mix of @Eriequiet, @Atilla and @anon7067117, I guessā€¦
I kinda hijacked their Derail. :sweat_smile:

That would work wonders as well. :wink:

Hmmmm that would probably make senseā€¦
Maybe microdermals would be a better idea for this use case. From what I hear, they arenā€™t nearly as problematic as transdermal. Donā€™t really have any experience with them though.
So what the implant would actually need is
A. the storage medium itsself (even micro SD are comparatively large)
B. some sort of scaffold to hold the electronics, probably made of surgical SS and partially coated with bioreisin
C. the actual interface (could probably be quite a simple affair, with the logic being handled by the cable you proposed)

And it being a magsafe style connector would work wonders for not having your expensive new toy ripped from under your skin :slight_smile: so long as the magnets are weak enough

Itā€™s rather the other way round. Transdermals are more surgery to implant (making a pocket, then punching out a hole in the middle of it, simply put), but much more resistant to daily life. Microdermals are installed by just punching a hole and ā€œleveringā€ them inside, but because of their smaller base, they tend to be ripped out a lot easier.

Unicorns are intersting creatures - some are nice, some are plain a-holes, just like humans. To make them like you is not that difficult, you just have to find one that matches your personality. And maybe sacrifice some babies on a cementary on midnight or so, dunnoā€¦ :stuck_out_tongue:
And it always help to use the magic wordā€¦

please

Coma beat me to it!! :laughing:

Transdermals are harder to properly heal. But once they heal, they are fairly secured in place. Even a moderate bump might not do much to it.

Now, Microdermalsā€¦
Those are easy to place. easy to heal. and even easier to fuck up badly! any tiny yoink and you are back to ā€œheal day 0ā€.

But the principle behing a midrocermal, if exxagerated, might work out fairly nice.

Would still have some issues @coma already explained very well on her other postā€¦

And some might solve global hunger!

:yum:

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Iā€™d have to review the USB-C pinout/specs, but IIRC the older microUSB style only actually used four pins for power and data transfer so if you went with a magvault style connector, only four small exposed transdermal contacts and one or two small subdermal magnets for alignment and holdā€¦ that seems to be a reasonable starting place for the concept. I know USBC has a lot more pins, but havenā€™t really looked at the spec

indeed!

Although I think I would rather have one larger transdermal plug, with all of those wires coming in.

If I recall, a good share of those are aimed either for fast charging, or for allowing the connection from either orientation.
I might be very wrong there, though.

On a similar noteā€¦
There is one other option, which is to implant a reef coral subdermal, anchored to the bone.
There is more to it, but the Idea is to trick the body to treating the reefā€™s calcium as dead bone, so it layers a new chunk of calcium on top of itā€¦ properly anchoring it to the bone. Thinking skull here, because this process was designed by a guy who wanted to have proper hornsā€¦ but also because the skin to bone location on some areas of the skull, such as immediately above the ears, is fairly constant (thus minimising shearing).

By having oneā€™s own bone being the material crossing through the skin you are to expect minimised reactions and methods might be devised to bond back the skin to that protuding bone.

Iā€™ve heard (yet never met) people who achieved the first stage here. Never heard a trustworthy source about the second stage (fusing the skin around the bone).

Yet, if this was achieved, you would have a proper bridge to run cables. :wink:

Anyhow, just spitballing untested theories here.

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Pondering about anything else was only useful to get that out of the way.
The only option (so far) tested on the longer term is the head :skull:

The good news is that the brain seems to be a rather welcoming interface to connect to.
Unlike the other parts of the nervous system.

šŸ›¤ļø

Holly F Molly, if unicorns approve :unicorn: :rainbow: :poop: :toilet: SquattyPottyā„¢ for sure Iā€™d better start urgent search for an intergalactical association of high authority to approve my letter!!

Iā€™ll need the masterā€¦

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What do you exactly mean?

I dig up the linksā€¦to be edited!
:chains:

EDIT:

ā€¦so I listed examples when wires are poked into the brain.
Recently I did some research about this.
I was especially interested in implants in the head and the number of wires (loosely speaking).

Specific examples

I found that there are a few ways to (what youā€™d consider) attach devices to the body.

  1. Like prosthetic limbs: pick up signals from the skin
  2. Stimulate the nerves mechanically: haptic
  3. Stimulate the brain electrically: the list I commented above.

ā€˜Neural Dustā€™ picks up muscle contraction directly. The implant recorded electrical potentials from the cerebral cortex.

It has a 64-channel interface.1 The Neuralink team in 2019 reports to stretch this number up to 1024 in rats. 2. A publication from 2004 analizes the relation between the number of electrodes and the audiological outcome of multichannel auditory brainstem implant (ABI). The report concludes that the quality of sensation can be improved with a deductive method. Implanted electrodes are de-activated if they donā€™t give auditory sensation, they give unwanted, stimuli or non distinguishable for another electrodeā€™s signal.

Bibliorgraphy
  1. Muller, R., Le, H., Li, W., Ledochowitsch, P., Gambini, S., Bjorninen, T., Koralek, A., Carmena, J., Maharbiz, M., Alon, E. and Rabaey, J., 2015. A Minimally Invasive 64-Channel Wireless Ī¼ECoG Implant. IEEE Journal of Solid-State Circuits, 50(1), pp.344-359.
  2. Chung, J., Joo, H., Fan, J., Liu, D., Barnett, A., Chen, S., Geaghan-Breiner, C., Karlsson, M., Karlsson, M., Lee, K., Liang, H., Magland, J., Pebbles, J., Tooker, A., Greengard, L., Tolosa, V. and Frank, L., 2019. High-Density, Long-Lasting, and Multi-region Electrophysiological Recordings Using Polymer Electrode Arrays. Neuron, 101(1), pp.21-31.e5.
  3. Kuchta, J., Otto, S., Shannon, R., Hitselberger, W. and Brackmann, D., 2004. The multichannel auditory brainstem implant: how many electrodes make sense?. Journal of Neurosurgery, 100(1), pp.16-23.
Links

https://thejns.org/view/journals/j-neurosurg/100/1/article-p16.xml
https://escholarship.org/uc/item/1rb9m5f5
https://www.cell.com/neuron/pdf/S0896-6273(18)30993-0.pdf

I was looking for a link to reference this:

There was a neuro-surgeon explaining how poking stuff into the head is a better way to connect stuff to the nerves, because the brain itself doesnā€™t hurt.
I didnā€™t find it yet. =( I think it was a video of an operation, maybe hearing implant? I deleted my search historyā€¦

I am by no means expert on the field. Neither have time to do extended research on the topic, so I am not competent by any stretch of the imagination. These are more like off-cuts of my research that can not be submitted at uni.

On a side note, I just watched the End of Evangelion, and the 2nd half is just a full blown acid trip
I am really not sure how I feel about it
On one hand I really liked it

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You meant this?

or something more technical?

@Midoriya, I thoght I could get away to unicornlad without being specific :frowning:

Auditory brainstem implant, Neuralink, Visual Cortical Prosthesis System, deep brain stimulation to the :brain:
Other than that you can mainly do hapticā€¦but you can prove me wrong by citing ultrasonic neural dust.