For now I think I’ve narrowed down the implants I’m going to order first (flex ug4 and NExT v2) but I’ll list all the ones I plan to grab eventually and where I was thinking about implanting them. I just want to do an insanity check to make sure these are good spots for them.
xDF3 on L0 for that sweet 8kb storage (maybe store some medical records in text form?)
FlexM1 v2 on my right arm where a watch would go (don’t wear a watch), also getting this as I’ve heard the x series one is very difficult to interface with in hotels and such.
VK thermal just under my armpit for more accurate temp readings (no thermometer necessary is a very cool idea)
flexsecure on L2, might get another one and install in the left arm below the watch area depending on available storage for apps. One for crypto and the other for fido stuff maybe? I’ve got test cards on the way now to try out everything and seeing what apps work together.
Any tips or tricks for placement? Anything to watch out for? And should I stagger installations or could I do them all at once? Thanks for any help y’all can provide!
Great post, good info, good questions, good research.
Good idea.
The following is just my opinion, so take from it what you will but make your own decisions.
I will mostly buttet point fir readability and time saving, but there should be enough to get the…point
Before I start, my opinion would always be a Flex over an xSeries, but I see why you are wanting the xSeries.
FlexUG4, great option, the most flexible use implant there is.
AND if you have a Flipper, this is next level convenient
R1 great position for a work badge
The NExTv2, at first I wasnt sure why you would want one, but guessed and was confirmed when you said
R0 perfect spot for a 2in1 implant
The LF also makes sense, or an xEM if you dont care about the blinkie…but it sounds like you do.
This one is Tricky to answer.
Outside of it being far more capable than NDEF storage, but that seems to be what ~95% of what people use it for.
The FlexSecure would be a better option, BUT you are also wasting capability for just NDEF
I agree though, It would make a great little storage implant. P0 is a goid spot for it if you use it a lot, for me, I would use it as a data stash in a hidden implant position and save the P0 for something I woukd use more frequently or another 2in1 like the xMagic.
With a UG4, do you need a FlexM1?
Dont get me wrong, I have both, and I got the gen2 so I could write to it with my phone, and used it for hotels etc.
But that purpose became my FlexUG4, and my FlexM1 is now enrolled into a number of things so I dont really change the UID anymore, but I use it a lot…
OK
Also I remain a fan of the gen2, but I think the gen1 is more popular
More reading here
I have / had xBT in the armpit, great location, I had to use a Flipper, but ai always have one nearby so it was easy, The VK Thermal would be much easier with a phone, andcI imagine an RSP would certainly help getting a consistent read.
I will be getting one at some stage, so I can’t vouch for its accuracy just yet, but research telks me it is good.
Fantastic plan.
They can also be used as a backup after your testing.
Great investment
Thats totally up to you, and everybody will have there own opinion on that, Heres mine and what I woukd do.
If you’re going to pay a pro and baby your hand for a day or two and the healing itself takes about a month, you might as well get it all done in one shot.
When you break down to even just the time and money, doing it all at once is a no-brainer:
Healing Time:
If you are getting one implant or ten, for each implant, it takes about a month to heal. Do them together, you heal once over a month. Do them separately, you’re looking at nearlyba year of constant healing.
The Logistics:
Every single trip means commuting, fuel, parking, and taking time out of your day.
Multiply that by 10 if you do them individually.
The Piercer’s Setup:
For every session, the piercer has to do the paperwork, prep the station, and open up fresh, sterile supply packs (drapes, gauze, lube).[Also provided by DT but some like to use their own]
Because a single session saves them a ton of setup and material costs, they SHOULD pass those savings on to you with a discount for multiple implants.
In short:
Travel once, stabby-stabby, and you’re completely done!
Healing:
Depending on your job, you may want to take a couple of days or weeks off to baby you healing.
Cons:
Discomfort over multiple install sites might make “doing things” a little more difficult.
More shock and a strain on the body for healing.
Plan them out,
Take a photo of your hands (Or stock photos)
Photoshop / draw / AI your suggested implant positions
And post here for opinions if you want.
From what you have above, I think you have a great plan.
Also, Was “insanity” check rather than “sanity” check intentional?
To jump in real quick on one point: available versions of the flexM1 v2 are gen2 and ZUID. The latter of which is kinda like gen1a with the ability to toggle gen2. You can also change the SAK unlike gen1a or gen2. Details are on @Equipter’s write up on the product page.
Is this because of the readability of the implant? they just seemed to be more convenient to implant over a flex or bioresin implant. How bad is it to read one? it didn’t seem that bad when watching people use their implants on readers.
At first i didn’t really care about the blinky but then i thought more on it, it would make a cool demo to have a light inside me I could also have my contact on there or something. Along with the idea of a demo I was thinking about getting an xGlow XL in my forearms but we’ll see, kinda wanna plan a tattoo to go with it. And even though the x5577 is $25 and very tempting to order anyways, the light is just fun . There’s also a site we operate in that uses an LF fob and my guess is that its a T557 (no test cards yet or a flipper) cant scan it with my phone so its probably not an HF fob.
It offers a lot of storage which is very cool to see, i was thinking it would be good to have my medical records in there at least the most important bits. I have seen on the forum here that theres some work being done on a password storage system of some kind for it. This is definitely one of the ones i wouldn’t get right now but something to think about for the future after testing with a card at least.
That’s why i wanted a different chip to handle that, just seemed like a waste to keep basically a text file on there rather than an OTP and Fido2 applet. again more testing needed, I don’t even really know what else can be done on it besides that password vault i mentioned.
This is a good point, I could probably get 2 UG4’s instead of a FlexM1 and a UG4 probably depends on price when i actually order it. Its def one of the ones I would get later though after testing with the cards and seeing what I like and dislike.
I was thinking about that, I like the FlexSecure for its openness and hack-ability and the apex for its easy to use ecosystem. i guess i just don’t want to be tied down to a single ecosystem? i also might not fully understand what i’d be losing going for one vs the other.
Honestly no but, I will say it was because it fits well here
Thanks for the pointers! I’ll probably stick with doing the NExT V2 and UG4 first to see how i do with them, then later get a larger order of things after testing further with the cards. Also, now that I’m thinking of it is it recommended to use Topical Anesthetic? It seems like people don’t do any of that and just raw dog it. Do the implants hurt a lot? or is it more like a piercing?
also still putting out feelers to piercing places nearby for the work to be done. The closest one on the map is 3 hours away… I’ve printed the handouts and will probably have to go in person cause no one answers their phones.
The NeXT V2 and the UG4 is what I have! I have R0 and R4.
I use the NV2 a lot. It’s my PC login, my garage door and my work badge. I’m working on a project to make it my startup for my ebike I just need to find time.
I’m saving up to get an Apex in the L? and I might get another NV2 in L0.
Also, now that I’m thinking of it is it recommended to use Topical Anesthetic? It seems like people don’t do any of that and just raw dog it. Do the implants hurt a lot? or is it more like a piercing?
I used nothing for the NV2. It’s not that bad. Mine bled a lot but pain wise it wasn’t bad.
My UG4 was painful, I just used lube. Not unbearably painful but it’s significant. It’s manageable enough I’m going for seconds with an apex. I mean you’re shoving a 4g needle into your hand. It’s going to hurt! Be brave little toaster!
In my opinion and experience, with a flex you are just putting the odds in your favour.
But there is absolutely nothing wrong with the xSeries
This all depends on reader to reader.And also, depending on the person using it, how deep it is, etc.
.
You have a number of options with this, and again, a flex would be better than an xSeries.
If you want him to show it off or demonstrate the capability, the last thing you want is people sliding their phone all over your hand, a flix simply increases their odds of finding it.
Any area of flixes that you mentioned above will do this for you, me personally I have a FlexNT vet, his amazing range, and for its purpose hi, business kadok cedara would work very well.
Here is a write up I did for it
Again, I’m not saying you need to get one, as you will have that capability with your other choices, i’m just sharing from my experience.
This is almost certainly correct.But unfortunately, not always one hundred percent, as with everything, there are exceptions to the rule.
If you can share a picture of the fob and or reader, we might be able to narrow it down for you
Currently, just for the iphone and it was just officially released today
Pain was, this all comes down to your own personal pain tolerance
I put together a very scientific poll for the community
Have a look here, and you might get an idea of what to expect
Regarding comparing it to a piercing, this is a hot topic, but in short it is safer than a piercing.
A piercing makes two holes, an implant only makes, one unless the installer fucks it up.
Flipper on the way now, any recommended NFC apps for it besides this one Ultimate magic 2 flipper ? planning to put momentum and grab the various ir/subGHz/extraTools/etc… from the github you linked here :flipperzero_white: (HOW TO) - Flipper Zero - GitHub & OTA Updates Got the Midwest Gadgets extender sticker from defcon on the way too. Excited to scare my coworkers when i give the reader a thumbs up and it lets me in lol.
After some time playing with the working Proxmark I think I successfully copied my work badge to the test card. took some time figuring it all out and have yet to test it (will tomorrow). -h was my best friend though lol. Didn’t realize I would need a different reader for the javacard so i’ve got that on order now.
Are there settings I should be setting on the cards from the test kit/implants? I know on the NExT page there’s a write-up about needing to change the password. I wouldn’t want other people being able to sneak up on me and lock my implanted chip on me (or me set it wrong cause I’m dumb). is there anything to look out for with that?
Does that run locally in my browser? Kinda weirds me out putting sensitive stuff ln web apps like that. Also tested my badge and it worked like a charm! Now to decide if I want the UG4 or a dUG4T… so many tempting options to choose from!
Yes. The functions and the terminal are WASM.. web assembly. The server just shoves the code to your browser where it runs locally to talk to your hardware. There is also a precompiled portable client you can just download and run directly on macOS or Windows without proxspace and all that.. just download and run.
That is awesome! I’ll def put that to use with my phone if I have to sniff anything, I was thinking of ways to add a raspberry pi or something and connect that way
Flipper and card scanner acquired. Flipper is pretty cool, grabbed a buncha files and apps and installed momentum on it. Also copied the fob and badge to it and tested the emulator and it worked well for both. The fob is a HID H10301, which I’m not sure I can copy to the t5577 implant. The card scanner worked with the global platform pro GUI app but havent gotten to really use it yet. But it did scan and see the apps. (Not the fido app for some reason that came back as unknown)
Okay after a lot of testing and trial and error with the javacard its very cool, love all the things you can do with it and setup several apps on it, very surprised it could do all them, fido2, otp, pgp, free mem, and seedkeeper. With room for more even. They all just work, though the pgp applet took forever to understand how to setup and get working right (and several bricks of the applet that needed a reinstall.) is there a way to keep this card as a backup and copy all the data to the implant? I know for the pgp applet I can upload the private keys but what about the fido2 and otp applets? I’d hate to have the implant fail and I just lose everything.
You can’t copy data out, that would kinda defeat the purpose. To make backups of fido you just enroll more than one fido device. One fails and you remove it from the list and hopefully replace it. For otp you need to back up your keys elsewhere.. some people print the QR codes out on paper. Then you can add the same keys to multiple Apex.. that’s what I do.. one in each wrist.
Thanks for the reply, that makes sense though not being able to export anything. That is a good idea about saving the otp keys though, never even thought of that. Also never used passkeys before so I didn’t realize you could add more than 1. It’ll be a process transferring keys around but once its setup it should be good. I’ll have to figure out a good process for me to duplicate keys and get them to the card and implant.
. There’s also a site we operate in that uses an LF fob and my guess is that its a T557 (no test cards yet or a flipper) cant scan it with my phone so its probably not an HF fob.
but, I will say it was because it fits well here 
I’ve printed the handouts and will probably have to go in person cause no one answers their phones.